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With David and Johnny away this week... something a little different this time around. Danny Brown is the Head of Podcaster Support & Experience at Captivate Audio. He joins as a guest Super Friend to share what he knows.
The friends discuss the state of podcasting, including the use of live streaming platforms like Boomcaster, Descript and Riverside, and the challenges of adapting to new technologies like Spotify's video push. They also explore the importance of community management and the value of offering multiple monetization options, such as one-off tips and memberships. The Friends highlight the need for podcast hosting compaies to cater to specific audience segments effectively and the potential impact of platform-specific features on content creators. Finally, they touched on the importance of consistent content and the role of events in fostering community and education.
Connect with Danny Brown's podcasts and everything else Danny.
A Transcript and video of this episode can be found on our network page.
Check out more from the Superfriends below:
Johnny - Straight Up Podcasts
David - Boston Podcast Network
Jon - JAG In Detroit Podcasts
Catherine - Branch Out Programs
Sarah Burke (Voiceover) 0:02
Matt, welcome to the podcast. Super Friends. Five podcast producers from across North America get together to discuss podcasting.
Matt Cundill 0:11
It is the February 2025, edition of the podcast, Super Friends. I'm Matt Cundill, podcast wizard. Yet I feel a little bit out of focus. It's something. We're just gonna we'll talk about it today as we go around the table. A few changes. By the way, we're gonna go counterclockwise. You might notice a new face and two last ones. We'll explain that in just a sec, but we'll go down below me to Detroit.
Jon Gay 0:33
Jon Gay, owner and CEO of jag in Detroit podcasts, where nobody knows your story better than you, and we just help you tell
Catherine O'Brien 0:42
Hello. My name is Catherine O'Brien. I'm tuning in from Baton Rouge, Louisiana and my company's branch out programs, podcast, producing all the good stuff
Matt Cundill 0:50
and new face, our special guest, super friend today.
Danny Brown 0:57
Oh, that's me. I'm Danny Brown. I'm in a little place called port Sydney, which is about three hours north of Toronto in Canada. I head up the podcast to sport team@captivate.fm I'm a serial podcaster with way too many podcasts to mention.
Matt Cundill 1:12
Yeah, actually, we read through your resume, and you've got a lot of podcasts that you work with, including in and around podcasting, which feels like it's the one that you do with Mark Asquith, who, I guess, headed up Captivate for many years before it was purchased by global. And that was around the time that you came on board to work at Captivate,
Danny Brown 1:31
yeah, I think yeah. I probably arrived maybe just a year before they got purchased. So obviously they saw all the good stuff I was bringing in the team in. Thought, we better buy this for someone else does. But yeah, been at Captivate Since 2020 so this will be my fifth year, and in September, actually, I've joined the team. Yeah.
Matt Cundill 1:50
So Danny had an opportunity to be on my podcast a while ago, and he's got an incredible story. And if I could just sort of take do it in 20 seconds or less. He was such a great participant on on the Facebook boards and on the on the, you know, where people need help with podcasting, that it really sort of provided a backbone, and you know, what he could do and how he could help people, which is how he kind of got on to working in the support department and the community group at Captivate. Do I have that right? Danny, yep,
Danny Brown 2:18
yep. Pretty much I was on the cam, Facebook voice so Captivate Facebook group, but I was doing a bunch of stuff on Reddit as well. And yeah, like, I love podcasting, like everybody here, so it just made sense to be answering questions. If people had questions.
Matt Cundill 2:34
Well, we're podcast producers, and we do this for a living, and I might even sort of step into the territory where I hear you say on podcasts that you know, the podcast gurus will say something. So we get together as podcast Super Friends to make sure that we get it right. We're not those podcast gurus who give out bad information all the time. So that's why we're here today, to make sure that we get it right. And we're glad that you're here
Jon Gay 2:58
today. I think Danny unintentionally transitioned us into mentioning our two regulars who are not here today. Because, if you notice, when Danny took a sip of his beverage, the beverage said, number one, Dad, how they mug rather. So do we want to reveal why our compatriots are not here with us today?
Matt Cundill 3:16
Yeah, we'll start with Johnny podcast. He is not here today because he is now a dad of 24 hours to a young girl named Keely. So congratulations to the family, Peterson family, who are who have got their first and
Jon Gay 3:32
David, David Yaz in Boston, had a conflict. It was not able to join us today, but that opens the door to have a great conversation with Danny.
Matt Cundill 3:40
So Danny, why don't we just start right here? Because we're doing we're doing this live, and we've already sort of fussed a little bit with getting it set up. I don't even think I'm completely in focus yet, but we are doing this podcast. It is a live podcast. And do you have a favorite platform that you recommend for for doing live podcasting? I
Danny Brown 3:58
do yeah, I used to use stream yard a lot. We used to do all the captivity webinars, like live streams with that. And then I kind of remember why, I think we mark was looking at different platforms, whatever. Personally I use boomcaster. It's like remote recording, kind of like streaming on Riverside, and that does remote, remote recording, live stream, and all the cool stuff you'd expect. But just like I find it built for indie podcasters, indie creators, doesn't throw a whole bunch of bells and whistles at it, so it's nice and easy to use and jump on
Matt Cundill 4:32
favorites from our other Super Friends,
Jon Gay 4:34
Catherine,
Matt Cundill 4:37
wow, for
Catherine O'Brien 4:38
the live streaming I feel a little remiss because of the fondness that I have for Riverside that I have not tried the live stream function yet. I can't convince anybody to go live. I think that especially all my clients, they love the security of the fact that it's recorded and edited product. So I but and I do feel a little remiss. Even the super friends that we haven't done alive from Riverside. But of course, the perennial joke that I love to too bad David's not here, is that we're all going to end up back on Zoom somehow, that that's going to it's going to be the the cockroach after the atomic disaster. We're all going to end up somehow back on Zoom.
Jon Gay 5:20
I will say I was a squad cast slash descript devotee for a very long time. I've recently started using Riverside more and started exploring the tools like Katherine. I have not done a live stream in it yet, but there are tools for their magic audio enhancement, as well as the ability to create short form videos for social right within the platform. As I've gotten more used to the interface, I really do like it a lot. My only, my only complaint about Riverside is, unlike squad cast and Adobe's audio and video enhance their magic audio, is you toggle it on and you get that file, as opposed to being able to lessen the effect of 80 or 60 or 40 or 20% to, you know, salt to taste, depending on your individual piece of, uh, of audio. So
Matt Cundill 6:07
that's going to bring me to a question that I'm interested in, how Danny's going to answer, and that's, you know, using zoom to record your podcast. So someone says, Can I just use Zoom? How would you answer that?
Danny Brown 6:21
Yeah, yeah, you can. It depends. I hate depends. It depends. But yeah, I mean, zoom, it's reliable. It works, people know, to use. So there's no weird stuff and weird UIs to try jump through. You just jump in recording. You're good to go. And have you got the, I think if you've got the pro account, you can also download, you know, studio quality, local recording, or separate records, at least, so you can tidy up afterwards. So if you're just starting out, then you just want a nice, simple interface and something that you're comfortable with, because everybody used it three, four years ago for the longest time. I don't think there's anything wrong with it. And then if you want to, sorry, move up to, you know, have big branded stuff and, you know, audio enhancements, etc. There's a lot of other tools that you can use and choose depending on your budget and, you know, your comfort level for technology, etc. So you never put anybody off because they say we're going to use Zoom. I think that's a bit snobby, or it can be anyway, I
Matt Cundill 7:16
agree I'm snobby.
Danny Brown 7:19
I thought, again, really an audios can be snobby, right? Like you want good audio obviously, I
Jon Gay 7:24
think it's worth mentioning that, you know, in the beginning of the pandemic, Zoom was a much lower quality, and you couldn't have the separate files, you couldn't have the authentic studio sound like Danny was just mentioning. And they really have come a long way with their tools in terms of catching up and making close to podcast quality things. The only issue is, of course, sometimes you do have that Zoom lag and you sometimes have ducking of audio. But you know, I think they have come a long way. I'm actually doing a seminar next month on how to start a podcast less than 100 bucks, if you're on a limited budget, and maybe you're gonna go to anchor because or spot five or creators because you can't, don't want to spend money on podcast host. Maybe you don't want to spend money on squad cast to Riverside. You could do it on Zoom and host it and essentially do the whole thing for free, except for buying
Matt Cundill 8:12
your microphone. Danny, I feel like when people make a decision about where they're going to record their podcast, whether it's live or not live, it comes down to, do I use descript, or do I use Riverside? But there are so many other ones that are out there. Clean feed comes to mind. What are some of the other ones that you might want to point to people where there might be some value that they may not know because people in the chat rooms or on Facebook groups just start talking about them?
Danny Brown 8:40
Yeah. And you mentioned, I mean, you're doing audio only. You don't care about video, clean feeds. Awesome. I know James over at pod news is always, you know, because that's what they use for the pod news weekly review is clean feed, and I've used it before. It's a good, really good quality audio only option. I feel there's less options now, because people have put more money into maybe two or three platforms. So you get that other side. You've got squad cast. I mentioned I use boomcaster. There's also zencaster, obviously that's still around, and they'd have the live record, the live stream, and I think it's on the remote recording. I can't, you know what? I can't think offhand and off the streamyard. We're using streamyard right now. I can't think of any others offhand. There we used to be so many more that seem to have disappeared in the last 32, three years, like ringer blacks closed down. Now, welder was a good one that closed down. There was another one. I can't recall. So I think it's already solidified in a four maybe five platform loan. You choose your you know your portion, so to speak.
Catherine O'Brien 9:42
I'm interested just about the topic of live streaming in general. So somebody that I respect in the he's not necessarily in the podcasting realm, per se, but he knows a lot about media, digital media, and he. This prediction is that we're going to just see a lot more live is the main thing. And then clips are that's going to be where you repurpose your content. It's we're going to be moving away a little bit from the edited product. Live is going to be the main focus. And the edited thing is going to be clips that promote the replays of the of the live stream. I'd be interested to hear your take on that is that, do you think that we're moving more towards live? Is that going to be more of the main focus for people going down the line that? No,
Danny Brown 10:31
so that person, is this someone that has a video channel and does video podcast that is correct? Yes, that's why, that's why they say that. And I'm not saying the wrong or anything. But if you look at audio, podcast, and in live and you obviously, you've got the live tag that you can use on certain podcast apps, where you can, you can listen along to the podcast being recorded. So this was on an audio on the show at the moment, and we had a LIVE TAG enabled on the feed, and I was going out to the apps to support it. People could listen to this as we record it. But I feel that that approach works great for video, but it doesn't work great for audio, because not a lot of apps support the live feed. And that might change the next few years, because we're getting we're seeing more radio hosts now that you know, a lot of mainstream media and radio channels are closing down, we're seeing a lot more radio hosts moving to podcast and in the live option, where they can sort of essentially have a radio show again, just using a live feed and the live option in their feed. So yeah, I know there's a great podcaster in Canada and Jeff Humphreys, I think we're gonna Matt here. That's right. Jeff Humphrey, I think. Yeah. So Jeff Humphrey, he does that. He I was at the pod summit event in Calgary last August, and Jeff was one of the did a live podcast there, and he was saying that he does the exact same thing Catherine, where he'll basically only promote the the reels or the YouTube shorts or the clips or whatever, to drive it, you know, to drive awareness of the podcast, and then people will listen to the podcast on audio apps. So I think that looks a little hybrid, but I certainly that's why is I was curious if it was someone who was already doing a video channel, because that definitely worked for for that medium. I
Catherine O'Brien 12:10
think that one thing that I know that the Super Friends have talked about a little a little bit over the years is that sometimes we're we're following what the platforms are doing. So for example, if the platforms get really hot on hey, you know, we're all about short form video, now suddenly we're being encouraged to put out short form video, but we're that makes us always trailing. We're always kind of falling behind. You know, we're always following instead of being innovative and lead, you know, taking the lead for whatever our audience wants, or what our clients need, or those kinds of things. So there's a little bit of a I always feel like there's a little bit of a dance that if people are going a particular way, the platforms, they incentivize that direction. And I don't, I don't know that we talk a lot about and enough about that that we sometimes get pushed a direction that maybe we wouldn't have otherwise been going Catherine.
Jon Gay 13:00
I think that's very similar to what I was just was just thinking, which is how much of what you asked is determined by the social media gods and what they're prioritizing in their algorithm. Everybody said, Oh, well, you gotta they're prioritizing video, so you got to do those shorts, or they were prioritizing the shorts in and of themselves. Well, you know, maybe that means there's doing you have to do more video, or you have to do more lives because and all that. So that really is interesting to me. I think that to your point, these, you know, Zuckerbergs and musks and others of the world, maybe having an outsized impact on how the industry is evolving.
Danny Brown 13:37
Well, I think if you look at Spotify and their big push this year onwards for video, and they want a lot of YouTube creators to come away from YouTube and go to Spotify. And that's great if you reach the threshold of their very high threshold for a creator to make any money. And then you have to give away your dynamic ad in search. You've got to give away any of that kind of messaging, and you've got to exclusively host with Spotify, and you know, for your show up there. So I think, yeah, that's a great point, John, where we're looking at what we're being told we should be doing, as opposed to, I mean, Spotify, even Spotify is on numbers. They say they've got, At the last count, they've got 330,000 video podcasts, but they've got 6 million podcasts overall that's from their own, like media releases. So it's still only about five 6% of all podcasts and Spotify are video. And video has been on Spotify Since 2020, I think when they first launched it, so a good five years. I know they've only really just started to push it now, but five years and only five or 6% of the shows our video, that kindly sort of dictates everybody still thinks of YouTube as a default. If I want to watch a video, I'm going to go to YouTube and do that. So do you think
Jon Gay 14:49
that speaks to a larger issue of Spotify, trying to invade all the spaces and be all things to all people? They're trying to out YouTube, YouTube, when YouTube just has such. Foothold. Do you think that's a wise on Spotify perspective?
Danny Brown 15:06
Yeah. I mean, I think the like, you understand why Spotify does it, because the they've got all the access to listener behavior, and, you know, viewer behavior now with video and how they can tailor that to the music that's on there. And audiobooks, now they've got audiobook so essentially, it's becoming a Super App for everybody. And if everyone uses Spotify, because I can listen to my, I don't know, honeymoon suite, I'm going to use that as a band. I can just listen to my honey, sweet honey and sweet playlist, and I can listen to a podcast, and I could read an audio book. So I understand why they want to do that, but it does. It does make me wonder if a lot of people buy into, you know, putting all the content on Spotify because they want to try and be part of the Creator program, which is cool, and then Spotify says, You know what, it's not doing what we quite wanted it to do for us. We're going to pull the rug on this and just go back to music, for example. What then happens to all these creators? I think you've just got to be wary of going all in on one platform, and just having that sort of multi channel approach. You still have, okay, video does go but I've still got audio as my go to. If audio goes away, then I still got videos my go to. You know, have some kind of, like multi, multi platform approach for that. What's
Matt Cundill 16:15
the reaction been about, you know, Spotify and this move to video, and by the way, I think he could be the only person on the planet with a playlist about hunting and sweet. And I'm sorry, David's not here. So we could have a 1980s discussion about their their hits that they had back in the mid 80s. He could
Jon Gay 16:32
do an episode. He has a podcast called Top 10s, where he does where he evaluates different sets of music. That's right, those
Catherine O'Brien 16:41
playing along at home get that on the podcast. Super Friends bingo card. Good job, everybody. He gets
Matt Cundill 16:46
a plug every week, whether he's here or not, nice but. But the reaction, I mean, it seems like a big ask to have people okay, Spotify is now it's for your music for listening, and podcasts for listening, and audio books for listening. And now they're asking people to start watching it. It feels like that's a very tall ask to get people to change the way they're going to interact with this app.
Danny Brown 17:09
Yeah. And I think, I mean, it's funny, we recorded an episode in a run podcast, and today about podcasting two point on where that stands after five years. And it was a similar kind of line it trained for. There is. It's an ask to get people to use podcasting 2.0 features, whether that's you know, chapters, transcripts, funding, whatever it is. And it can be an ask to get listeners or users of the Spotify app to know there's even video available on the app, because you have to enable the video feed in your settings and you've got a cover. I'm not sure if it's the same. Now, we used to have to have, like, a pro account or a prima account, so you get more than 30 seconds worth for the video, etc. So there's a lot of stuff that you're asking the viewer to do that that might be a hindrance. I know. I mean, at the moment, is a bit too early, you know, for all of podcasters that have put their video on to Spotify to see how it's working out for them. I know when I put and I've not got a big YouTube channel, whenever, like last 100 people subscribe, or whatever, so I know that I, even if I put my videos on Spotify, that's they're not going to get anything there. There's no traction there. But it'd be interesting to see anybody that's got a large audience that are now manually uploading the videos to Spotify, but still keeping a YouTube channel at the moment, how that plays out? And you know, are people actually playing and watching? Because at the moment that the data says people aren't really using Spotify for video. It's still a low percentage of the overall podcasts that are on there. But Spotify is only really stuck pushing the last 36 to 12 months. So 12 months from here, Bob would be having a different conversation, maybe.
Matt Cundill 18:42
And you, though, are probably fielding a lot of questions from your users at Captivate, saying, hey, how do I get my video up on Spotify? And like, Don't you have to have like, a conversation with them to say, Okay, this is what it entails. You're going to lose your dynamic audio insertion, and you're, if you, Oh, you want to monetize, you're going to need 10,000 hours, and you're going to have to be releasing episodes on a regular basis. And I feel like you're, you're actually doing the support work for for Spotify. Well,
Danny Brown 19:11
wait, this was two trains you thought there. So you've got, do I leave Captivate or Buzzsprout or lip syn and go full over day Spotify for creators the hosting platform, so I can do all this in house, or do I still keep my hosting platform with us, with bus Brooke and etc, and then just manually upload the video to Spotify. And yeah, you can do that. But then the drawback is, if you want analytics, especially YouTube, if you want analytics for the video, you have to go into Spotify dashboard for that, the problem becomes, if you do have the video enabled, but you only want to listen to the audio version, Spotify uses the audio version of the video, so now your RSS feeds been taken out the equation, and the analytics don't go back your hosting company, so now you've still got to go back to Spotify to get the audio analytics for that episode, because it's now a video. Go, so there's only little minor niggles or issues, if that's the right word, where you've just got to educate. So yeah, you can definitely upload it and stay here at Captivate. Just be aware that if someone listens to the audio of a video that you've uploaded that's coming directly from the video no longer the RSS feed, so you won't see these plays here. And as you mentioned, because it's doing that you're not getting your dynamic inserts, you're not getting your sponsor messages, you might be losing, you know, some dynamic pre rolls, some mid rows, whatever. So there's a whole bunch of things that you've got to really be aware of and be happy with that secret. That's fine, because I want to get more video views, as opposed to audio. For example,
Jon Gay 20:41
Laura, who's still have so many hoops to jump through. And I feel like for folks who are getting into podcasting, okay, podcasting has the fastest growing medium out there right now, whether you're talking audio or video, everybody wants a podcast. Everybody's heard of a podcast. By and large, you know, you're, we're, you know, we've had, we're podcasting 2.0 and fountain. I know Matt was big on that, but there are so I think because we live this every day as our full time jobs, we forget there are people who are like, Oh yeah, someone told me, I should start a podcast. How do I do that? What's an RSS feed? What's a host? You mean, I can't just talk into my computer microphone and have it sound great, you know, I can't just sit there with two friends and not plan out the show and Bs and hope something good happens. There's I feel like we're talking about such an advanced class when there are so many folks who are new to this who need to learn the basics and walk before they run. I hate when I say something in his met with silence. It's
Catherine O'Brien 21:41
like that. No, that was impactful. That was impactful. Danny,
Matt Cundill 21:46
do we, I mean, there's all the talk that goes on. Do we make it too complicated? I mean, do we spend too much time talking about podcasting 2.0 and trying to, you know, kick that count can down the road. And there are people who want to get into this, and they, you know, we we make it we make it sound harder than it really is.
Danny Brown 22:05
Yeah. And quick blog, listen to next week's episode, because I'll answer a lot of your questions. Yeah. And mark on the episode, when we're recording it today, said the something along these lines, where to us, it's boring because we are in the space where, you know, we're working in the industry, etc, and sorry, it's boring in general to us. We might get excited about it because it's cookie stuff. It's like, we know what I can do and all that cool stuff. Same with video, we know what it can do. But yeah, like say someone just wants to start a podcast. I see it on Reddit all the time, and they'll just ask, How do I start? What gears I need? You know, what hole should I go for? Do I need to do video all the normal questions you'd expect to ask prior to starting a podcast? And you can have 50 people, and you'll have 50 different answers, some good, some not so good. So I think that's an opportunity for anybody in the space. It's just to, yeah, step back. Tell people how to get started easily and without a huge upfront cost and what's involved, etc. So they can find out if they enjoy it, if they like it, and then if they do, then they can start to, you know, look at gear, look at Horse, look at video, if they wanted to do video, for example, and all the cool stuff that comes with that. But yeah, just, you know, people don't, as a podcast listener, I don't care if it's come comes from an RSS feed, it's coming from a video feed, or whatever it was in the background on YouTube, a smart speaker, whatever it is, if I'm listening to it, then that I'm happy as a general I'm speaking as, like, a general podcast listener, or someone that's, you know, using a 2.0 app or whatever. So yeah, I completely agree, Matt. I feel we can sometimes get too excited about all the cool stuff that we're seeing, the shiny, cool stuff that we're seeing advancing conferences, and just forget that people just want to make a podcast and share it with their friends.
Catherine O'Brien 23:52
Yeah, I've sometimes wondered. It seems like we sometimes focus on these things that are actually easy to answer, because some of the harder things, like building an audience, making sure that you have a consistent perspective, or the things that you want to share, you know that you have content that is going to take you the distance. Those are harder to get together, so we don't seem to focus on those. But then the the things that can be answered, like, you know, having a host, having a mic, those things get an ultra spotlight, as if they're the most important things, but the things that are going to sustain you maybe would take it a little bit of a harder push to really make them sustainable.
Danny Brown 24:33
And I'm glad you said that, because Ashley Pritchard, who's over at descript, I think she's still on Matt leave at the moment, maybe I'm kind of called but Ashley, she said she's spoken before about, you know, when you start a podcast, have a list of topics for at least six months. Look at her for six months worth of topics. Because if you don't have that, you're probably not ready to start. And I started to say that, but you're probably not ready to start, because you'll run out with topics, then you'll be trying to. Course, ideas and the content will suffer, and then you'll just get upset aboard and stop you'll pod feed, basically. So, yeah, sometimes, like, you see, like, the stuff that should be taught to new podcasters, or at least advise and say, This is what you got to expect. You know, it's not going to just throw a bunch of money at you, because Joe Rogan's got 300 million deals, you know, five years ago over, that's not going to happen, right? But here's the real stuff that you can expect. And this is the cool, fun stuff you can do while you're getting to that, you know, that stuff that you can expect Absolutely.
Catherine O'Brien 25:30
And to take it just 111, more granular level deeper is I that advice about the six month I first heard from Daniel Lewis in podcasting, and he made a point to actually write it down. And I think that that is the real key, is to actually write it down. Because we can trick ourselves to say, oh, six months, I've got that covered. That is no problem. I can, I can talk about whatever for days. But until you actually write down 25 different different ideas, 25 topics, how you're going to cover them, really, that is the test I would say to people that says, Okay, now you have, you have that idea bank that is going to get you ready to
Danny Brown 26:10
go. Yeah. And if you've got a guest or an interview show, can you get 25 people to come on for every single episode to talk about each of the topics? That's great. You've got 25 topics now. Can you get 25 people on to do that? Great point, yeah. So yeah, it's Yeah. Big, big, good questions to be asking up front.
Matt Cundill 26:31
I have a question about the live tag that you touched on a little bit earlier. So you're talking to two former radio people were involuntarily escorted out of the business as it began to sort of diminish and crumble. But, you know, like a show like this, which would you know when we go live? You know, you know, can we include a LIVE TAG so that there are apps out there that could, you know, listen to the show right now. Let's say on fountain. I know we could do that and a few other places. But if Apple and Spotify don't pick these up, and they really represent 70 to 80% of the usage of downloads in North America, it doesn't feel like we want to go it doesn't feel like we're going to have the effort to go all in on this. Is that one of the problems with podcasting 2.0 and trying to get new technology into the RSS feed. Yeah.
Danny Brown 27:24
And then I think that's, you know, if you throw YouTube into the mix as well, you've got that triumvirate of, you know, big platforms that a lot of people use because they don't care, like, say, about 2.0 features. They don't care about, lie, tag, etc. They just want to listen or watch whatever content they want to. You can see them apples, they've done some good stuff recently, you know, with transcripts and chapters and kind of funding with their subscriptions. It's not quite tied into that bit. So he's apples doing stuff, and Spotify is doing the wrong thing as always. But I think it's an opportunity as well, though. We can look at it and say, okay, yeah, it's never going to take off properly, because these three big giants aren't really picking it up. But if people start to ask for more, then this is where this podcast is. We got an opportunity to tell our audience, you know, Hey, did you know you can listen to this live? If you find a podcast app that supports that and recommend one, you know, just make it a call to action on your show. Just say, by the way, if you use an app like fountain, or use an app like x, y, z, you can listen to this live when we go live, and you can drop questions in, well, maybe not drop questions unless they're watching, you know, online, we don't have the cross app comment yet or anything, but you can have the opportunity, you know, or you can pre send in questions before the recording, but watch your question on the recording, so, you Know, on the live stream. So, you know, it's right there for you. So think as more people is more listeners, to start to ask for more, it might be just a tipping point that the bigger boys need to start, you know, supporting and again, if creators are going to the platforms that are promising them a lot of things at the moment, and these things don't actually happen because of whatever reason. Like, like, I say, maybe the threshold is too high to make any money that they make already make on YouTube. As they start to move away from platforms as other opportunities, you know, to get apps that also support videos, you can use your turn enclosure, not to get too geeky, but you can use internal enclosure tag as well. And if you've got a YouTube channel, you can drop the episode link for that YouTube video into the pod, into your episode, and the podcast apps will let you play that video, and these analytics go back to YouTube, etc. So I think there's an opportunity for listeners and podcasters to sort of work together and maybe just to redress the balance, but it's a big ask, I can say,
Sarah Burke (Voiceover) 29:42
do the podcast Super Friends support podcasting 2.0 so feel free to send us a boost if you're listening on a newer podcast app. Find the full list at new podcast apps.com
Matt Cundill 29:54
so you know, we have people who are commenting right now. We are live. And so I think that's one of the. Real attractions for for doing a show live is that there are people who you know will contribute to the show, and you get the reaction. I mean, that was one of the excitements of radio, is, oh, look, the phone lines have lit up. What did I say? And how much trouble Am I in? Yeah, but, you know, but if we're podcasting and we're just recording it together in a studio, then you know, it's not nearly as exciting. I mean, you know, get all sorts of cat calls here today. Well, they are hurts.
Danny Brown 30:27
I be coming down. I wasn't sure if that was like, bad or good or whatever, but I'm just like, hogging the mic or whatever. So I apologize Addie, if that was the case.
Matt Cundill 30:35
Well, we're getting commented here on our looks. Yeah.
Catherine O'Brien 30:38
Excuse me. I
Jon Gay 30:39
trolled.
Catherine O'Brien 30:40
I know. Excuse me, my luscious mane should make up for all the lack of hair on the rest of the panel. Here I am. This is a little. I'm a little.
Matt Cundill 30:52
I didn't even notice that. Yeah, I didn't even notice that this, yeah. Anyway, I'm sorry for the reflection. I'm sorry for the I'm feeling
Catherine O'Brien 31:00
neglected. I'm just gonna say
Matt Cundill 31:02
yes, but I guess that comes out. The question I have here, and we can kick this around, is about live comments and feedback, and is that holding podcasting back, not having that ability to see live comments or feedback or ongoing comments, with the exception of the work that Spotify has done recently. By the way,
Danny Brown 31:28
I would say no, only because most podcasts speaking on audio podcasting, point of view, it's passive. You're doing something else. You're not really concentrating, like if you're watching a YouTube video properly watching it, your attention is on the video, and you can put comments, and you can be in the live stream, drop comments in, and you can see that and reply to that. You can only do that if you're driving a car or, you know, if you're on a treadmill a gym, you can't be typing, because then you just fly off the treadmill and go, you know. So I feel there's an opportunity, if it's tied into maybe smart speakers, you can speak your comment and it goes in. But I think from a type in adding it manually, I don't think that setup is there at the moment, just pure because of how we consume, generally, how we consume audio podcasts.
Matt Cundill 32:17
I'm having fun with the Spotify comments and say, unleash that. And sort of advanced it in the last year or so to do some auto publishing. I think the feedback is great. It's quite positive to get that everyone finding the same. The
Jon Gay 32:30
default question is, what you think of this episode, right? And then you can change it from there. No,
Matt Cundill 32:35
no. They can even just have comments, okay,
Danny Brown 32:39
but I think the only drawback there is you can only reply once as both the podcaster and the listener, so you can continue a thread after that one reply, and that's it done. There may
Jon Gay 32:50
have been so
Matt Cundill 32:51
you gotta get their phone. You gotta get their phone number on the first comic
Jon Gay 32:58
hotlines are lit, yeah,
Matt Cundill 33:00
yeah, give me a call. We can talk about that problem.
Jon Gay 33:06
See, this is, this is where my inner millennial comes out. Don't call me and text me.
Matt Cundill 33:10
Oh, that's right. Okay. Well, I want to pivot one to an episode that you did recently, Danny, I think you had somebody from pod Fest on your show. I believe it was Chris and you and I met at Podcast Movement. I think it was last year you had the table set up. Want to talk a little bit about events, because that's a subject that we all talk about, who's going to this, which events are the right ones to go to. So how are you I mean, some of them you have to go for Captivate. And you set up. Of course, it's business. But when you look at all these all these conferences, what's the right one for a new podcaster to go to if they can afford it, if
Danny Brown 33:50
they can afford it. So I would say, I don't know. Mark said this in that episode when he had Chris on pod fest. I've never been to pod fest, but I hear amazing things about the community of the support the indie vibe there. So it's perfect for the indie creator the if you're in Canada, I would say pod summit was amazing last year, Tim, his wife, and the team, just did an amazing job there. I know they're changing up a little bit this year. They're giving a bit more space to indie advice, etc. Because one of the feedback that Tim mentioned, one of the feedback he got from attendees was there was some larger branded podcasts or podcasters there that didn't quite fit the needs of the indie creators that that were there. But yeah, that was a great event. Again, really dedicated to education and good education. And I've heard really good shows and but good shows, I've heard really good comments and feedback about the podcast show in London, yeah, if you can get over to the UK, or if you're in the UK, because that seems to bridge it really well between enough industry stuff for the corporations, the brands, big produce, production, agencies, etc. Yeah. But also the live podcast, the indie spaces, etc, the creator networks. So there meant, there's certainly a good cross mixture there. What
Jon Gay 35:10
you said a moment ago about the event in Canada, Danny, it makes me think of the feedback or the scuttle, but I was hearing in the halls Podcast Movement in DC this past summer where there's this pushback of, oh, look at all these big sponsors seven, eight years ago. This was for the smaller indie podcasters. It was a much more collaborative community. And you know, it's the old rock band analogy of, Oh, they've sold out, or whatever it is. But the counter to that, that I heard was, well, don't you want this industry to grow? Don't you want big players to be spending big ad dollars and big investment in this industry, and not have it be a bunch of Indies like us doing it. So I'm kind of curious where you fall on that spectrum.
Danny Brown 35:49
Yeah, and I think it must be hard. I mean, I heard that feedback that last year was a lot quieter than even the previous year over in Denver, and it did seem when I looked at the exhibitor list from the two years like 2023 and 2024 I think the exhibitors were done by about a third last year down the work the previous year. And it seemed a lot like it did seem quieter footfall, but the venue is a lot wider and a lot more open space than it was in Denver. So I can see both sides, where you're trying to be something for everybody, right? You need sponsors come on board to help pay for the event. As you mentioned, you John, you want big brands to come in and hopefully share some advertising dollars and sponsored dollars with all creators, not just the big, you know, famous branded ones. And to do that, you need to get new podcast tools and apps and innovations, etc, that the larger platforms can help drive forward. But then I feel for these type events, it can put indie creators off because of the cost. When it's held, it's like during the week as opposed to the weekend, so you've got to take time off work as opposed to just come for a weekend. For example, the accommodation and the flights can be expensive, depending on where you're coming in from. And for most of the podcasters, their annual budget for marketing, if they're lucky, is about 500 bucks. So to blow that, or to actually blow more than that, to go to an event, it really has to be worth your time, and you have to take a lot of education and stuff from that event. So it's, I feel it's hard for event organizers to get it just right, and it's also hard for attendees to say, okay, where to put my money? Because if you go and you don't get the stuff that you wanted, you're gonna have a negative opinion of the event, even though it might have been a great event because it didn't meet your your specific needs. It's hard to do right? That
Jon Gay 37:39
trip isn't a business expense for all of us. That's true. Yeah,
Matt Cundill 37:44
I have a question for Catherine. Catherine, if you were to look at the events that are out there now, knowing that, like we went to Podcast Movement for many of the early years, we met in 2017 and I think your last event, your last Podcast Movement event, anyways, was 2021 What? What would you look for in a show or an event in order to make you interested in going
Catherine O'Brien 38:06
well, I think Danny really was hammering home exactly some of my own personal feelings. I think that I've made it known that I, I went to, I went to the second Podcast Movement, and I went every single year, and the event, it just it changed to whom it they were speaking. There was by the time I was stopping, there was zero hobbyists. I, I my favorite dead horse to beat is that there are two worlds of podcasting, the indie world and the the corporate, let's say the big podcast and the independent podcaster, and I somebody, I think it was, it might have been James credland, who started calling that in between the middle class of the podcasting world. And I think that in just like in society, the middle class is getting squeezed. I think the podcasting middle class has gotten really squeezed. So I don't know the answer to that. I also have heard great things about podfest. It's in January, which is sometimes just a little hard after coming off of the holidays first thing in the year. But you know, let's not make excuses. I do sometimes think it's hard to give something that is going to really help that middle class podcaster, that's person in that podcast. That's right in the middle. I think that there is not a lot of information. What I like to call the the podcasting 201, there's a lot of podcasting 101, information, there's not a lot of podcasting 201, information. The people who aren't aren't the size of of the advertisements make sense. They might have a some sort of a monetization with a tip jar, or some way to be supported through a membership, something like that. I'd love to hear some comments from Danny, because I know Captivate has some great things about one off payments as well as memberships. But. Aren't maybe they don't have the number of downloads that can be ad supported, that there is just not a lot there. So I'm, I'm answer. I'm looking for those kinds of things, just like everybody else. Yes, the answer you wanted. Matt,
Matt Cundill 40:16
yeah. I think it's great, because it dovetails into a lot of the things that Danny has spoken about on on the show, and what Captivate really tries to do, isn't that, right? Danny, try to find, you know, a little something for everyone, but offer, yeah, you're going to be able to do this, and we're going to offer you that too,
Danny Brown 40:32
yeah. And that's, sadly, with the in and around podcasting show, like the whole like the theme song, it's, it tells you, right there, what it shows about it's not just for the geeks and OGS is for everybody in and around broadcasting. So try take the the stuff you normally see at the top level, and make it nice and easy for the indie new starters to understand and use the tips there and and why some parts industry matters and why others don't, and advice and stuff like that. But, uh, yeah, I love that 2201, that you mentioned there Catherine, because it's, it's true, there's like, um, I feel that's maybe where events can still struggle, because they do have to bring in visitors to make it worthwhile, to put on um, and to do that, you have to put tracks on that try attract everyone, whereas maybe the better option is to do like, virtual events for the Two Oh ones, because now you're not having a put any outlay. And if you want to support the people that are doing the live stream and stuff, you can maybe just make it. Hey, Ari on this, and black is great at this. She just says, pay what you can for a ticket. We're going to put the tickets over here. You pay what you can. You can do for three if you want, but you want to support us, pay what you can. And that works really well. And then you can really knuckle down and say, Okay, this for this live stream, we're going to talk about the LIVE TAG and how you can use it to grow an audience. You know, want to listen on the go when it's gone out. Here's how to make it easy to support your show. Here's how to, you know, attract sponsors, even if you've only got 100 listeners per episode, because that's 100 people that sponsor is going to be real interested in. Yeah. So I think there's a great opportunity. Great opportunity for educational stuff there and online. Is really simple because it's easy to do, but relatively easy once, you know, Matt gets his focus sorted out and stops distracting everyone. But it's really easy to do, and it's, there's not a lot of, you know, tech buying or anything, and you can watch it live. Can watch it back afterwards. There's no lot to travel or anything. So I agree, there's definitely huge opportunity there for that kind of education. Agreed. I
Catherine O'Brien 42:32
want to pivot, if we can, for just a moment talking about now that Matt has kindly put up your title as a Chiron here on our panel, I have a question about community management and experience. I love, I absolutely just love that you were very active member, member on different Facebook groups and different boards, and that's where you were putting in all those reps. And then you now that has turned into an actual position for you to be employed and working. And I'm wondering if you could just talk a little bit about, first of all, just participation. And it sounds like it was a real labor of love. I would love to hear your ideas about participating, participating in a community like that. And then on the other side, I've heard that community management can be a real bear, and it's one of those things that it seems like it would be great, because you're just getting to talk to all, you know, kind of interested people the time. But I know that it's not always super easy. And I'm wondering if you could sort of give us a little bit of the highlights and the not as highlights,
Danny Brown 43:33
yeah. And I think the main thing is, you've got to like the industry that you want to be part of, right? So I love podcasting long before I joined Captivate. Well, I joined Captivate as a customer before an employee. But, yeah, I love podcasting. I've loved it for 2016 2017 I started doing it so I was always and I've had many customer service experience roles in the past. So I like helping people. It's a natural thing. So you put these together, where you're you're talking about a topic that you love, and you're doing something that you really enjoy, which is answering questions. I think the most important thing is you don't do in a sales kind of way. So on Reddit, for example, if there's questions I'm answering a you've got to disclaim that you're with Captivate because obviously there's a there's immediately, there's that there could be a bias there, right? But I will go in, and I've seen other community managers or employees from other hosts do the same thing. You just go in and you answer the question, you know, and you don't say, Well, you can do this at Captivate. You should come here and do that. You know, we've asked, we'll do an awesome job. And we've recommended, you know, if captivity has got a very specific type of podcaster that we are good for, and that's a serious indie podcaster, up to the large branded podcast. So why we don't have a three plan? Nothing wrong with three plans, but there's a reason we don't go after that target audience, because the tools we create is to help them, you know, save time, grow up, etc. So. When we're I can when I'm speaking on Reddit or answer on Reddit or anywhere. Basically, it's all about just giving the right answer, because you know yourself, guys, there's a lot of crappy, bad advice out there, and you don't want new podcasters to get sucked in by that and hate the industry because somebody told them, yeah, you make millions and you can record on your Chromebook speaker sitting in the park, and people will love it. You can do that if you want that kind of the ambience, and that would work 100% for sure. So yeah, you have to go no sales pitch. It's just a genuine help. And people, it surprises me how many people reach out say, Okay, thanks for that. I appreciate that advice. Does Captivate do that, or does Libsyn do that? And we have, I've done it before. We've done it before. Captivate, if we're not right for you, we will recommend the host. It is based on our knowledge of the people at that hosting company, the tools they've got. And we'll say, Hey, you want to go speak to the guys at Libsyn? You're gonna go speak to the guys at Buzzsprout. Do you want to speak to Todd at Blue, but they've got an awesome WordPress installation solution where you can do a whole bunch of cool stuff. So it's just really, it's about helping. And on the flip side, because of that, you always get people that say, Oh yeah, well, you'll recaptivate. So of course you're gonna say this, x, y, z, because you're trying to trick people into coming to you. It's like, no, genuinely, we don't care. So we're here, yeah, exactly. So it's you've got to, I think because, because I'm Scottish, I've got, like, a fixed skin, boy, we don't care. And I'm a Gen Xer, so we really don't care. A Gen X then is that you're never going to really get my deckles up. Good luck with that. I will pay you. I'm going to say how much, because people come after it now, but I will pay you if you really get me to lose my cool when I'm just talking about something. But yeah, it's I love it. I think you have a certain mindset, but just enjoy it as well, and love the space that you're in right, love the community you're talking
Jon Gay 46:55
about. It's funny, there's so much toxic negativity online. We're not gonna go political here, but there's so much of that that it's really surprising. Sometimes, when you're just nice and genuine to somebody online, sometimes they get surprised, and it really can go a long way.
Matt Cundill 47:14
Denny, a little bit about podcast host, because it used to be like one of the big questions back in 2016 2017 I was going around the conference floor at Podcast Movement. And hey, Catherine, what do you use? Oh, I use Libsyn. And I was talking to rob Greenlee at the time, and he was, you know, at Spreaker. And Spreaker had this, this live thing that they did. And I went to Todd at Bloomberg, and I was like, Oh, crap. I don't really understand anything about WordPress. And I they felt like they were all very, very different, and they don't feel nearly as different anymore, but there are smaller, subtle differences now. I'm like, Oh, I captivate you. Got this cool donate button and and, you know, Libsyn, you can get some form of monetization, but if you go over to megaphone, you can have like dynamic audio insertion and a bunch of programmatic ads out there. So for somebody today who is looking for a podcast host, what should they be what questions should they be asking and what should they be looking for? Yes,
Danny Brown 48:14
I mean, the basics any podcast hosting company are exactly the same. You create an episode or create a show, publish an episode, distribute it, measure it, and hopefully monetize it. If that should go that's it. And every podcast host will offer that in some form or other. It comes down to then, okay, well, what features do you want that are important to you? So for example, I got a show that's an interview show, and I use, like captives. Got an integral guest booking platform that that captivates basically, I used to use commonly, but now I can save money on commonly and use Captivate one. So do the features that your your host offer that others don't? For example, are they useful to you? If not, then don't look at that as a feature, because that's not a benefit to your needs as a podcaster. So I always recommend it funny. You asked, What would you say? I have basically a default reply on Reddit for this kind of question, for when people were asking, what, what podcast host should I use? And it's just basically, make a list of must haves. Make a list of nicety halves, and I make a list of don't cares. Then see which podcast hosts have got most of the must haves, and then say, okay, do they come as part of your plan? Do you need to pay extra for some? Is there any limits? What's the support like? Are these nice to haves more important than some of the must haves? And so just really take time to really identify what's key for you. And that generally tells you what host is right for you, because, like you say, if you want a really solid WordPress backed platform where you can host your own files, essentially have your own RSS feed. Blueberries amazing for that, because they've got that locked down with a power press plugin, if you go is to have automated ads put into your show. Maybe red circle is, you know, one. Go with if you want X, Y, Z, there's other hosts to go with. We're very specific at Captivate, like I say, we go after send type podcaster, and we give you all the features from day one. So the only thing you have to worry about is your monthly downloads, because we feel if you need to go to the next tier, you're already monetizing in some way that will offset that hosting cost, hopefully. So if that's what Mars great, we'd be great for you. But you might not want download limits. You want my you know, you might want unlimited downloads, but be happy with maybe storage limits or whatever. So again, it's the it depends. And I always hate, you know, I always deflect it when I say it depends. But make that list. Do anything worthwhile, take the time and understand what you really, really want to quote the Spice Girls, and then go for that.
Catherine O'Brien 50:48
I don't want to skip past, yeah, I don't want to skip past. One thing that I thought sort of a good podcast or lesson is your Captivate knows who they are for and that's a really huge step that most people don't ever get to is like, exactly who are we speaking to? And that's so critical. So I just wanted to just draw attention to you know exactly who is your ideal podcasting customer. And I think that's pretty valuable. I'm wondering if you can share any insights with us about some of the options of monetization, like memberships versus the one off donate button the tip jar, as I was referring Can, can you share any insights about those, those two phenomena? Some people believe that no one has ever, in the entire lifetime of the internet clicked a donate once. But I know that that's not true. So I'm wondering, maybe you can talk to us a little bit about that. Yeah,
Danny Brown 51:37
it happens. I've got well in my one of one, my one minute podcast tip show, quick plug. It's got some one off tips there, you know, because it's simple, like, say you got a tip a jar, or tip donation button, and people just leave a little donation. So, yeah, I mean, it works well. Memberships and tips working. It makes it easier if people don't want to sign up to a membership, because either they don't want to put a monthly amount down each month, and that's full understandable, especially in the climate today with job insecurity and people getting laid off, etc. But they want to support the show and they want to support the Creator. There's no like, just say, Okay, I'm going to give you a one off donation with five bucks, and that's awesome, and that could be your whole year. Now, maybe come back next year if you wanted to, and do another five bucks if you wanted to, but it just makes it easy in a field, the more options you offer your listeners. You're not, you know, cocooning them into Okay, well, I have to line up. I'm not sure if I want to support this person, and I can't afford that, but now I feel guilty because I really want to support this person, so now I'm going to give up something else, maybe to support this podcaster. And we can't support our favorite podcasters. There's too many, you know, people who do that, but yeah, so offer as many as you can. Memberships are super easy. And I can't recall who it was, someone at the funnily enough, at the pod summit event last year. So one of the speakers was talking about one off tips and memberships like Patreon as well, et cetera. And they made a really good point, which I thought was interesting. So instead of having, like, all the tiers, where five bucks gets you this, eight bucks gets you that, 20 bucks gets you this, make it low, make it three bucks, and it's just straight off, you know, if you want to do it, or me, make a buck, even if you wanted to, you like a buck a month, you got 100, 200 trillion people start to give you a buck each month that start to add up pretty quickly, you know, on a membership side point of view. And then obviously you've got the dynamic content, if you can put sponsor messaging and stuff. So sure, yeah, it's just mark my co host, and like the co founder, overcater, he he always says, like, he always talks about eggs and baskets, you know, have 789, different revenue streams, because if one does go away, if a sponsor goes or, you know, the rug from under your feet, you're not you're not scrambling, right? So do all do memberships, do tips, do streaming SATs, if you go to 2.0 app, do, you know, buy me a coffee? Do PayPal, direct link people saying checks. There's a great podcaster in the US, David mes he does fun facts for ID with his doctor, Leila, and people will write him checks and send them in for the show. Wow. You know, so those people want to support you, and it doesn't necessarily have to be the ways that we typically think of right?
Jon Gay 54:14
The checks don't take a fee out like Venmo and people exactly.
Danny Brown 54:18
There was another guy sent them because David mentioned on his one of the episodes that their show was starting to slow down a little bit because the Chromebooks were giving up the ghost. Both him and Leela were using like, six, seven year old Chromebooks or something. An audience listener sent them to Chromebooks for him and his bar, because goes back to that value for value, right? That listener got really good value from this podcast. Hey, I will take care of your Chromebooks for you. Here you go. So, you know, people want to support you.
Jon Gay 54:47
That's amazing, great point. That's nice, probably a good spot to leave it on. That's a nice high pull of a stance on the that's high notice we're gonna get. Well,
Matt Cundill 54:55
I have one more thing I just throw out there. And this one is actually, you know, from Marques. With. And, you know, one of the things about, you know, listening to your podcast and just following you guys is that you'll poke holes in the beliefs that I have. And one of the beliefs that I had for many, many years was you gotta release on a consistent basis. There's to me, no stopping. You've gotta always be releasing episodes and creating and releasing it consistently and continuing and building your audience. And Mark said, Well, I stopped for a year because I got bored, and then I had a child, and then I wanted to watch Star Wars, and then I wanted to play golf, and then I came back after a year, he did an episode, and he got the exact same number of downloads again. So I was like, well, there goes my bad ideas
Danny Brown 55:42
well. And I think if your contents evergreen, and I know that can't always happen, you know, if you've got, like, like, an educational podcast, or if you've got not so much an education, but a news, current affairs podcast, where it needs to be out basically the day of that news story, and then once it's out, unless it's, like, a really big news stories disappear then, right? But I feel, if you've got evergreen content where anybody can jump in at any time and listen to an episode and still get the same value that someone listened three years ago got, then you'll continue to get that. It just comes down, you know, just tell people you've got a podcast, if you you know, you asked about, you asked about questions online. Catherine, how you get, you know, be involved in the community, etc. Yeah, just let people know how I actually talked about this in an episode last year. If you're interested, I'll send you a link, you know, so you're not breaking any rules. You're, you know, spamming comments or whatever. And then that goes back to what John was saying, or Matt was getting phone number, I think, in the comments. So, you know, you've now got that connection. So, yeah, Matt, that was an interesting lesson. For sure,
Matt Cundill 56:45
you've got three podcasts. They are called in and around podcasting, which I believe you co host with Mark Asquith. You've got a podcast called five random questions, and you've got one minute podcast tips, and these are the three ones that are active, and you've got about nine or 10 more that have pod faded. So, and I thought it was great. I thought it was great and brave that you listed all the stuff that had pod faded. And it sort of shows your proud past of all the work done in podcasting. Yeah.
Danny Brown 57:10
And then the funny thing, I mean, some of these pod faded ones still get listened today, right? So, of course, you just say, don't, don't pull them down. Just leave them there. But just, you know, just be up, throw in half, stop this one. But I'm doing this one now, for example,
Matt Cundill 57:20
Danny, thanks for joining us. Where can we find you over the next number of months? Where are you going to be and how can we connect with you? So
Danny Brown 57:28
you can obviously find me the little link down. Watch that link. I guess it's a fake URL under my name there. Danny pod, that's got all the podcasts I've currently got and the ones I've had on. There's just like, sorry, not a link tree thing, but a bio link or whatever. Catch me over it Captivate. You know, if you want to come in, got a little chat icon down at the bottom. You've got any questions about start or anything, just hit that chat icon up. Either I'll be there or one of the teams be there. I'm not sure I'm allowed to say this or that, because I don't know if the team knows this yet, but I'll be in London for an event in May. So is that related to the podcast show? It's very related. Yeah, it's, yeah, I'll be over there, because I'm not going to any, I'm not going to any of the US events this year, because we're doing some different stuff. We're trying to do, like different events, and, you know, put the team to different areas, and then fjord and Calgary, later this year, should be the pod summit event too.
Matt Cundill 58:26
All right, Danny, thanks so much for joining us. We'll say goodbye as we go around the table. We'll start with Katherine.
Catherine O'Brien 58:34
I will accept checks. My name is spelled the C and the O, apostrophe B for the O'Brien there, go ahead and send checks for me to Matt. Matt will handle all of that for me. Otherwise, you can see me on social media at Hello Catherine. Oh
Jon Gay 58:48
John Gay jag in Detroit podcast. You can pay me by Zelle, which comes right out of your checking account. Just find me on social in on my website at jag in Detroit.
Matt Cundill 58:59
Send us a boost. Use your fountain app. You can send us a boost where we're completely lit with that sort of thing. But we'll also take checks as well.
Sarah Burke (Voiceover) 59:07
Thanks for listening to the podcast, super friends for a transcript of the show, or to connect with the Super Friends. Go to the show notes of this episode, or go to sound off dot network you.
